rfc82.txt

<VC++网络游戏建摸与实现>源代码


RFC 82                   Network Meeting Notes             December 1970


   Engelbart: More or less what comes our way.  A system will exist in
      Spring 1971, to allow an agent to insert items into a catalog.
      The dialogue that goes on will determine which way the data base
      grows.  We are pretty sure that eventually SRI will have to charge
      because of many potential users not at primary sites seeking limit
      resources.

   --: What about an NCP for your 10X.

   Engelbart: If BBN's NCP is ready by February 1971, we'll use it.

   Crocker: How do people get access?

   Engelbart: Each site is registered.  Any person who gets in on a
      site's account has its access.  We won't worry about accounting
      until saturation occurs.  We would like to encourage use of the
      agent system to create and use a survey of resources at each site.
      Some subgroup should talk about this.

   Crocker: When can people meet to discuss this? (Tomorrow morning)

   Engelbart: We have nice facilities for developing mailing lists,
      private bibliographies, personnel profiles, but it depends on the
      interest of the network people.

   Engelbart: Agents have been set up with MIT, UCLA, RAND, UI, Utah,
      etc.  A good percentage of sites

   Vezza: Many sites are sending out stuff 3rd and 4th class.  Takes too
      much time.

   Crocker: Site status report.  ILLIAC IV not to be operational until
      mid-71, on network later (72?).  Other possible sites: RADC, AWS,
      NCAR.  Currently up: UCSB, RAND.  Imminent (January 71): MIT BBN,
      Harvard, UCLA, Utah, LL, SDC.  Some percentage by end of year rest
      in January.

   Heart: A brand new IMP system (major change) goes in tomorrow.  Some
      more sites are thinking about coming on.  The network will grow
      consider- ably beyond what's already on board.  We too are
      interested in site resource information.  No long term interest,
      but we will put information on paper to help ARPA.

   Crocker: A lot of people are yawning.  What about meeting schedules?
      During FJCC's? 1 day vs. 2 day meetings? What about dual East and
      West coast meetings?

                                                          End of Meeting



Meyer                                                           [Page 7]

RFC 82                   Network Meeting Notes             December 1970


                               Network Meeting
                          9:15 AM Tuesday, 11/17/70

   Crocker: Engelbart will talk in more detail.  Later may discuss
      logger protocol and file transfer.

   Engelbart: Basic thing is a collection of documents with a catalog to
      describe it.  Entry has lots of data items, including where to
      find it.  Techniques for adding and updating entries.  We do it
      now, but would want to give capability to other sides, partly
      because we can't determine what's of value. (Displayed 3 types of
      printout.)  1) Catalog listing, by ordinal index in collection and
      NIC index.  for inventory control, finding out what's there. 2)
      Compacted format on one line. 3) Sorted by author-one line per
      entry.  We Will have procedures where an untrained user can manage
      a collection.

   Meyer: How are these systems implemented?

   Engelbart: We have a compiler-compiler on the 940.  Our subsystems
      are written in specialized high level language.  We are moving
      this over to the 10X.

   Heart: How many people can the 10X support in rough figures?

   Engelbart: Perhaps 100-1000 collections.

   --: Perhaps people could supply own DEC tapes for additional storage.

   Engelbart: Could, but requires on-site operator.  Slow access.  We
      don't have money for more storage, but are considering shipping
      files down to UCSB.  We provide on-line querying of on-line data.
      Willing to worry about data management, whether or not we store
      it.

   Crocker: Please describe the various subsystems. (Description by
      Engelbart follows.)

   Heart: Have people tried to use it over the network?

   Engelbart: No.  Don't have an NCP on the 940.  Decided against
      putting it in a system that is going away.  The biggest hang up is
      when 10X gets an NCP.  Bobrow developing it, but it is slipping.

   Heart: Who is going to get at it (SRI) early?

   UI: Illinois can access only SRI to begin with.




Meyer                                                           [Page 8]

RFC 82                   Network Meeting Notes             December 1970


   Postel, UCLA: We plan to use it.

   Heart: Would be a significant task if someone would take it as a goal
      to get into Engelbart's system.

   MITRE: We're going to use other systems form BBN's 10X.

   Engelbart: We are trying to isolate essential subsystems for people
      to use easily.  Files are organized hierarchically and will fill
      out as years go by.  Documents are referenced by pathnames.
      (Discussion of systems follows.)

   Crocker: Row does one get into the system? (Engelbart describes entry
      sequence to TOdas.)

   Crocker: How does one get registered on the system?

   Engelbart: Ultimately by personal entry, but currently there is one
      user id per site.

   Meyer: I think we're ignoring unsolved problems in the typewriter
      interfacing.  For example, the entry sequence to TOdas, where the
      user type one or two characters and the system types out the
      remaining chars of a key word, will be frustrating to use form
      half-duplex system like Multics.  Our system will not recognize an
      input line until a new line is typed.

   Various: Discussion of 1/2 duplex communication.  Brings out
      distinction between a) Full duplex systems where system echoes
      input vs. 1/2 duplex where input typed locally, and b) systems
      where each character is recognized as it is typed in vs. systems
      where entire line is recognized only after EOL char.

   Crocker: Isn't Multics the only half-duplex line-oriented system on
      the net- work?

   Meyer: I can't believe this.  Don't the IBM systems operate like
      that?

   Engelbart: We could have a 1/2 duplex interface on our system (SRI).
      Is it the Multics hardware that enforces this restriction?

   Meyer: Yes, the input-output controller.*

   ______________________________________________
   *  The Multics IO controller's typewriter adaptor is 1/2 duplex, but
   can accept break characters other than the "new line" character.




Meyer                                                           [Page 9]

RFC 82                   Network Meeting Notes             December 1970


   Engelbart: Each system should have a preprocessor to talk with other
      systems.  We're going to put a graphics interface onto the
      network.

   Meyer: How do you view these interfaces? Do these adhere to some
      network standard, or ill each system construct an interface to
      you?

   Engelbart: Standard network protocol.

   Crocker: Let's move on to other things.

   O'Sullivan: What about 2741's on your (CMU) 10X system.  Do you have
      serious interfacing problems? (CMU's 2741's go through a software
      package that transforms them into TTY 37's.  No serious
      difficulty.)

   Various: Brief discussion on how Multics handles input.

   Sundberg, HARVARD: Out 10X can take char-oriented input, but our
      higher level subsystems prefer line-oriented input.

   --: What about the efficiency of transmitting messages through the
      network one character at a time?

   Crocker: There is more output, which goes packed, than input, so the
      input inefficiency is negligible.

   Engelbart: We plan to have several different ports into our system.
      If each system had an NIC module; it could communicate with us
      without the necessity of a login.  We prefer a batch-type system,
      where a site sends spooled batch of edit requests, gets stuff
      back, and frees ports.  The typewriter transmission by line
      problem could be handled similar to spooled-up requests.  We
      encourage spooling, but will support interactive users.  We can
      support more batch than inter- active people.

   *  The Multics IO controller's typewriter adaptor is 1/2 duplex, but
   can accept break characters other than the "new line" character.

   Vezza: Do people feel that the full and 1/2 duplex issue is a
      problem? Let all the people go back and find out about this.
      M.I.T. with a full and 1/2 duplex system 20 feet apart can help
      here.

   O'Sullivan: There seem to be 2 issues: (1) echoing (full duplex) vs.
      1/2 duplex. (2) single character vs. full line transmission.




Meyer                                                          [Page 10]

RFC 82                   Network Meeting Notes             December 1970


   Crocker: Two definitions: Serving host - provides computation; using
      host - parasitic, manages user's terminal.  This view network
      usage as a link between local user and foreign server.

   Vezza: What about 1/2 duplex - full duplex interconnection if some
      full duplex systems echo other than what was input.

   Crocker: Two independent possibilities.  Let's diagram:

                        |     "2741"      |     "33, 35, 37"  |
                        |    hard wire    |      2 separate   |
                        |   local echo    |     lines all     |
                        |  computer does  |     printed       |
                        |   not echo      |                   |
            ____________|_________________|___________________|
            Process     |     hard        |          X        |
            each        |                 |                   |
            character   |                 |                   |
            ____________|_________________|___________________|
            Process     |      X          |          easy     |
            only after  |                 |                   |
            EOL         |                 |                   |
            ____________|_________________|___________________|

   Crocker: I claim there are really only two possibilities (marked by
      X's).

   Postel: Why about a system where echoing is done at such a low level
      that it can't be deleted.

   Crocker: If so, it's like non-echoing.

   Van Zoeren: Out system thinks we have full duplex TTY's, but our
      2741's are attached via a software transformation box.

   Meyer: What happens when non-echoing systems are attached to echoing
      systems via the network? I type my input line, then the echoing
      system responds with my input, then some output.  My system can't
      filter this because there is no way of differentiating echo from
      output.

   Crocker: This isn't necessarily a bad thing.  I type command
      abbreviation to SRI; then next output line is an expanded form of
      the input command.

   Meyer: Our goal should be one common protocol rather than a bunch of
      kludgy schemes to implement communication between specific pairs
      of hosts.



Meyer                                                          [Page 11]

RFC 82                   Network Meeting Notes             December 1970


   Long, SDC: We prefer to receive a full line fed through the network.

   Crocker: Let's differentiate between research centers and service
      centers.  Only the service centers are concerned with a half-
      duplex interface.  (lower left hand X on chart).  These include
      SRI, BBN, Multics.

   O'Sullivan: What about research center?

   Crocker: They can call up service centers, but may themselves be hard
      to use.

   Illinois: Then the ILLIAC IV will have to be half-duplex.

   Postel: I think half-duplex, line-oriented is weaker (than full-
      duplex, character-oriented protocol).

   Sundberg: Harvard can go either way, but prefer line-oriented system.

   Engelbart: Graphics terminals harder to put on network because of
      non-standard input.

   Harslem: You're thinking of the keys as function keys rather than
      input keys.

   Engelbart: I'm worried about people who want to use graphics.

   O'Sullivan: We haven't spoken to the problem of what kind of protocol
      should be established.

   Crocker: That's not a difficult technical thing.  We'll get to that
      later and make a decision.

   Meyer: I'm not authorized to make any decision.  I'm to report back
      to the MAC group.

   Crocker: Okay.  Then, a proposal, to be accepted through the normal
      mechanism.  Intermission

   Crocker: I will propose how to handle X'ed boxes, ignoring hard and
      ease boxes:

      Line-Oriented Input - 8 bit ascii including End of Line character:

              n, C1,...,Cn;

                 Cn=EOL




Meyer                                                          [Page 12]

RFC 82                   Network Meeting Notes             December 1970