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<H4>Subject: Use Win API in VB</H4><PRE>
In article <3s9s6o$4ea@Owl.nstn.ca>, paul-r@aci1.aci.ns.ca (Paul Rice)
wrote:
>I've just started trying to use API functions in Visual Basic but they
never work...HELP
You really need to pick up the book "Visual Basic Programmer's Guide to
the Windows API" by Appleman.
Paul Thurrott
</PRE>
<HR><A NAME=TOOL_VB_SERIOUS_LANG>
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<H4>Subject: Is VB a serious language?</H4><PRE>
In article <3teoq9$dot@louie.udel.edu>, weigand@stimpy.eecis.udel.edu (Steven Weigand) writes:
>
> I just got MS Visual Basic V3.0 for Windows. I've been reading up on it
> all I can, and from what I've seen, it is one HELL of programming
> language. I can see now that it would take me probably only 1 hour to
> design a crude desktop publishing program using VB. Seriously. That
> should impress the hell out of anyone. Of course, that DTP program
> wouldn't be that amazing, but it would provide some standard
> functionality (crude). If I approached this design using C (not
> visual), I could expect to be at it for weeks to do the same thing.
>
> But the question I have -- I've not really started programming much in
> it -- is this: Does the world consider Visual Basic programs as "real"
> programs that they can program real business applications? Or do they
> just consider it a proto-typing language, whereby you'd quickly program
> something using VB, but once you have a good idea of what you want done,
> then you use Visual C++?? I am assuming that VB is generally slower
> than VC++ in virtually all aspects? What are the advantages of using
> VB over VC++? And what are the disadvantages?
>
> Thanks,
> - Steve Weigand
> (weigand@udel.edu)
>
Hi Steve,
I am using VB to develop several packages. It is all it seems!
However, The problems I have run into are the programs written in VB are not
really slower than Visual C++ (although they are in the special areas) but
the programs run a little sluggish compared to VC++. I have to turn to
C when I want to deal with complex graphics or manipulate graphic images. VB
is a great package for most applications. There are ways to help this problem
though.
Is VB considered a "real language?"
The following programs of mine are published?
1) The COBOL Companion VB
COBOL study guide for Claude Simpsons COBOL book.
2) Actigrammer
An action diagrammer for Claude Simpson & Jeffery Palko's book.
3) Medtrak
A medical supply information system. I'm selling it through my
Computer Development Firm
I think it is a great language.
BTW: At first, I had a tough time using a language that had 'BASIC' in the
title.
<HR>
nspoo1900@alpha.nsula.edu writes:
>In article <3teoq9$dot@louie.udel.edu>, weigand@stimpy.eecis.udel.edu (Steven Weigand) writes:
>>
>> I just got MS Visual Basic V3.0 for Windows. I've been reading up on it
>> all I can, and from what I've seen, it is one HELL of programming
>> language. I can see now that it would take me probably only 1 hour to
>> design a crude desktop publishing program using VB. Seriously. That
>> should impress the hell out of anyone. Of course, that DTP program
>> wouldn't be that amazing, but it would provide some standard
>> functionality (crude). If I approached this design using C (not
>> visual), I could expect to be at it for weeks to do the same thing.
>>
>> But the question I have -- I've not really started programming much in
>> it -- is this: Does the world consider Visual Basic programs as "real"
>> programs that they can program real business applications? Or do they
>> just consider it a proto-typing language, whereby you'd quickly program
>> something using VB, but once you have a good idea of what you want done,
>> then you use Visual C++?? I am assuming that VB is generally slower
>> than VC++ in virtually all aspects? What are the advantages of using
>> VB over VC++? And what are the disadvantages?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> - Steve Weigand
>> (weigand@udel.edu)
>>
>Hi Steve,
> I am using VB to develop several packages. It is all it seems!
>However, The problems I have run into are the programs written in VB are not
>really slower than Visual C++ (although they are in the special areas) but
>the programs run a little sluggish compared to VC++. I have to turn to
>C when I want to deal with complex graphics or manipulate graphic images. VB
>is a great package for most applications. There are ways to help this problem
>though.
>Is VB considered a "real language?"
>The following programs of mine are published?
>1) The COBOL Companion VB
> COBOL study guide for Claude Simpsons COBOL book.
>2) Actigrammer
> An action diagrammer for Claude Simpson & Jeffery Palko's book.
>3) Medtrak
> A medical supply information system. I'm selling it through my
> Computer Development Firm
>I think it is a great language.
>BTW: At first, I had a tough time using a language that had 'BASIC' in the
>title.
I must say it is a good language for making programs by one developer.
The bigest disadvantage of VB is that it is much less suitable for
developing a program with a group of persons.
<HR>
rmeijer@xs4all.nl (Rob J Meijer) writes:
>nspoo1900@alpha.nsula.edu writes:
>>In article <3teoq9$dot@louie.udel.edu>, weigand@stimpy.eecis.udel.edu (Steven Weigand) writes:
>>>
>>> I just got MS Visual Basic V3.0 for Windows. I've been reading up on it
>>> all I can, and from what I've seen, it is one HELL of programming
>>> language.
Yup. I learned it in easily less than a half an hour (I had programmed
extensively in Quick Basic in the past, but did most things in
C/C++/Asm), and I'm amazed with it's power. If you don't need speed
(ala no calculated animation type stuff), the language is excellent. I
wrote almost an entire application yesterday in it including printer
support and lots of little bells and whistles. I love the language.
I just wish I knew how to use C/C++/Asm code to do things quickly from
within my VB programs. I'd also like to know how to make VBX's.. If I
knew how to do either of these things, I'd use nothing but Visual Basic
for applications interfaces (I *HATE* THE WINDOWS API! I don't
appreciate OWL or MFC either.). If anybody knows how to use other
languages code to make DLL's or VBX's I'd appreciate some pointers or
just references (a paper, a book, code in whatever language) on how to
do it. I've got virtually every compiler available to me.
>>>I can see now that it would take me probably only 1 hour to
>>> design a crude desktop publishing program using VB. Seriously. That
>>> should impress the hell out of anyone. Of course, that DTP program
>>> wouldn't be that amazing, but it would provide some standard
>>> functionality (crude). If I approached this design using C (not
>>> visual), I could expect to be at it for weeks to do the same thing.
I wouldn't go so far as an entire DTP in one day, but it takes so much
less work to code in VB that it's amazing.
>>> But the question I have -- I've not really started programming much in
>>> it -- is this: Does the world consider Visual Basic programs as "real"
>>> programs that they can program real business applications? Or do they
>>> just consider it a proto-typing language, whereby you'd quickly program
>>> something using VB, but once you have a good idea of what you want done,
>>> then you use Visual C++??
At my job here, they don't care how you got the program to work, just so
long as the end user likes it. With the exception of C junkies like I
used to be, nobody cares what language it was written in.
>>>I am assuming that VB is generally slower than VC++ in virtually all
>>>aspects?
Basically, when it comes down to it, if most of your program's time is
spent in the windows interface, VB will go about the same speed..
however, if you're doing heavy math or something like that (a ray-tracer
for instance) then VB just won't do unless you've got some really hot
hardware.
>>>What are the advantages of using VB over VC++?
Infinitely easier interface, simple language, and easier to read w/o
comments.
>>>And what are the disadvantages?
The actual code is slow, you don't have the power of an object oriented
language (making new controls would be nice... and so would some
inherited things... I'll take a look at Delphi soon. It promises
these things), and worst of all is that you have to do more projects
'cuz they get done faster (assuming you tell your boss that your done :).
>>Is VB considered a "real language?"
I wouldn't write a huge program entirely in VB. I don't know why. I
just wouldn't. It's not portable in any way which might be adding to
this. It doesn't allow group development at all either. This might be
possible using DLL's, but I don't know how to make those yet (somebody
show me? please?). Besides that, I still prefer C as a language.
I won't call it a real language until I can figure out how to pass
"Printer" and a form as the argument... my latest program contains a
disgusting hack until I can figure that out.
[plugs deleted]
>>BTW: At first, I had a tough time using a language that had 'BASIC' in the
>>title.
>I must say it is a good language for making programs by one developer.
>The bigest disadvantage of VB is that it is much less suitable for
>developing a program with a group of persons.
Agreed.
-gg
<HR>
jagrant@emr1.emr.ca (John Grant) wrote:
>
> In article <3tnt3s$7hn@louie.udel.edu> weigand@udel.edu writes:
> [...]
> >Yes, I hadn't thought of that before, but you're right on that one.
> >And I'd also like to see VBWin *compiler*, not just p-code and DLL's.
> >Anything to make really tight VB programs that stand-alone and are
> >faster.
> Sounds like Borland's Delphi is what you want.
I agree...Delphi is the best thing since sliced bread....
I'm a VB only programmer...(I lurk in these groups, mainly
to ask about API info....) have been since v.1.0... Tried
C/C++, but I think without a "course" in it, I will never
be productive fast enough to satisfy my own needs...
Now Delphi....wow... I have never used Pascal, but it is
not hard for me to pick up....
And the speed increase is incredible (but I haven't tested
the Borland Database Engine, to the Jet Engine yet)....
I'm now a big Delphi supporter... But the latest news on
VB 4.0. is that it will allow you to create OLE Automation
Servers... So I think it will give Delphi a run for the money.
(Delphi can too, but where's the tools ?....Coming, I hope...)
> John A. Grant jagrant@emr1.emr.ca
> Airborne Geophysics
> Geological Survey of Canada, Ottawa
ttyl
Jason
<HR>
In article <3tma45$8qs@news.xs4all.nl>, Rob J Meijer <rmeijer@xs4all.nl> wrote:
>nspoo1900@alpha.nsula.edu writes:
>
>>In article <3teoq9$dot@louie.udel.edu>, weigand@stimpy.eecis.udel.edu (Steven Weigand) writes:
>>>
>>> But the question I have -- I've not really started programming much in
>>> it -- is this: Does the world consider Visual Basic programs as "real"
>>> programs that they can program real business applications? Or do they
>>Hi Steve,
>
>> I am using VB to develop several packages. It is all it seems!
>>However, The problems I have run into are the programs written in VB are not
>>really slower than Visual C++ (although they are in the special areas) but
>>the programs run a little sluggish compared to VC++. I have to turn to
>>C when I want to deal with complex graphics or manipulate graphic images. VB
>>is a great package for most applications. There are ways to help this problem
>>though.
...
>>I think it is a great language.
>
>>BTW: At first, I had a tough time using a language that had 'BASIC' in the
>>title.
Yes, that's one problem I'm having with it. The word, "BASIC". :-)
You know, "Serious programmers don't use BASIC! They use C and
Assembly!" That was the old attitude that I grew up with. Now it looks
like Visual Basic is proving it wrong. I can see that processor speed
is a big reason why VB is able to be used today. Since processsors and
architectures are being designed to be faster, making super-slick fast
programs with C or ASM just isn't a major concern anymore. It allows
us to concentrate more on the problem, and not frees us from having
to nit-pick our code for hours on end just trying to reduce it a few
lines more. :-) I mean let's face it, a programmer's time is worth
much more than anything else, and VB seems to reduce programming time
considerably.
>I must say it is a good language for making programs by one developer.
>The bigest disadvantage of VB is that it is much less suitable for
>developing a program with a group of persons.
Yes, I hadn't thought of that before, but you're right on that one.
And I'd also like to see VBWin *compiler*, not just p-code and DLL's.
Anything to make really tight VB programs that stand-alone and are
faster.
Thanks to all that have responded to my first post!
- Steve Weigand
(weigand@udel.edu)
<HR>
gg@superdec.uni.uiuc.edu (gg) writes:
>rmeijer@xs4all.nl (Rob J Meijer) writes:
>>nspoo1900@alpha.nsula.edu writes:
>>>In article <3teoq9$dot@louie.udel.edu>, weigand@stimpy.eecis.udel.edu (Steven Weigand) writes:
>>>>
>>>> I just got MS Visual Basic V3.0 for Windows. I've been reading up on it
>>>> all I can, and from what I've seen, it is one HELL of programming
>>>> language.
>Yup. I learned it in easily less than a half an hour (I had programmed
>extensively in Quick Basic in the past, but did most things in
>C/C++/Asm), and I'm amazed with it's power. If you don't need speed
[snip]
>The actual code is slow, you don't have the power of an object oriented
>language (making new controls would be nice... and so would some
>inherited things... I'll take a look at Delphi soon. It promises
>these things), and worst of all is that you have to do more projects
>'cuz they get done faster (assuming you tell your boss that your done :).
You *must* check Delphi. It's all true.
>I won't call it a real language until I can figure out how to pass
>"Printer" and a form as the argument... my latest program contains a
>disgusting hack until I can figure that out.
No problem in Delphi. Just pass it as TObject and cast it to a visual
type, or pass the Canvas property on its own.
Luke
--
Luke Webber
* Note: The opinions expressed by Luke Webber are in no way supported *
* by his employers, Luke Webber Consulting Services *
</PRE>
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